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Commons

Clearing the Road: Lessons from the Ancient Maya

Robert Sitler

 

This article is excerpted from the forthcoming book, The Living Maya: Ancient Wisdom in the Era of 2012. 

Maya sometimes use the image of a path or road as a metaphor for human life. When Yukatek Maya ask, "Bix a bel?" (How is your road?), they are not merely inquiring about the conditions on the path you're walking upon, they are asking about your state of being as you walk. Similarly, among Q'anjobal Maya, the title for a spiritual guide is ahbe', "he or she of the road," a person that has developed the capacity to provide reliable direction on one's journey by virtue of their own lifetime experience of "travels." Just as when hiking on narrow Maya footpaths in the forest, in life, it's helpful for the trail ahead to be clear of obstructions. In describing a bit of my own life journey and its many detours, the lessons learned while hiking Maya pathways, and my passage into better comprehension of the year 2012; I hope to remove as many obstacles as I can from the road as I go with the hope that readers might be more inclined to accompany me.

Approaching fruition of the 13th pik  cycle in the ancient Long Count calendar during the highly anticipated year 2012,  some of my fellow New Agers describe Maya  as highly evolved spiritual messengers from a distant constellation. These extraterrestrial Maya come, it is said, to guide an increasingly disoriented humanity at this time of unprecedented socio-environmental crisis. I agree wholeheartedly that Maya ways have much to offer us at this uniquely critical juncture in humanity's Earthly voyage, but my own experience has pointed in precisely the opposite direction for the source of their culture's genius. While I am utterly unqualified to discount Maya connections to spirit beings from other realms, my heartfelt sense is that some of their most valuable Maya guidance for us comes not from distant stars, but from their culture's powerful connections with the physical planet beneath their feet. These eminently practical lessons from the Maya have the potential to "ground" our lives more harmoniously into nature's infinitely complex ways, to broaden our perspectives on human existence and to connect us more substantively with our innate capacity for compassion.

Maya traditions have emerged from the living earth like an ancestral yax te', an ancient kapok tree, more than a hundred generations thick. This ceiba, as it's more commonly known, represents the archetypal Maya World Tree, the horizontal axis of the cosmos with its deep roots drawing life-giving nutrients from the earth and its trunk reaching towards the star-bejeweled heavens above. A multi-millennially enriched cultural sap flows skyward into the tree's divergent ethnic branches.  Each bough grows with its own unique shape and puts forth distinctive blossoms of experientially acquired wisdom. Through reproductive metamorphosis these culturally specific patterns enter into more solid embodiments, the budding fruit that ripen into another living harvest of bronzed Maya babies. The Maya; like Chinese, Persians, Indians and other preeminent world cultures; have a multi-millennial written history and a vast wealth of practical knowledge that can inform modern humanity's cultivation of future generations. Their culture, like the others, has dedicated special attention to proper ripening of human fruit. As we approach completion of the 13th pik cycle in the Maya Long Count calendar, their ancestral tree is loaded with multicolored buds, poised for a season of particularly abundant cultural flowering, a time when Maya wisdom can release its sweet fragrance into the intercontinental winds for all humanity to savor.

Maya wisdom is, of course, in many ways similar to the vast heritage of practical knowledge acquired by ancient peoples worldwide, but what makes Maya stand out among these other global cultural expressions is their relatively large population. Maya make up what is overwhelmingly the largest Native cultural nexus in the entire North American continent. In fact, in the entire New World, only the Kechwa of the South American Andes have a comparably large population. This massive Maya numerical presence has led them into especially intense and sometimes extremely violent confrontations with the invasive tendencies of the non-indigenous world.

More recently, the proximity of the Maya homelands to the United States and the temporary immigration of tens of thousands of Maya into the American working underclass, have recently brought this ancient, truly American, culture into extensive contact with our modern ways. Maya sometimes suffer as a result of this closeness to the United States, so out of concern for their well-being; it behooves us to be more aware of their traditions. Even from a more selfish perspective, a deeper understanding of Maya culture can be vitally helpful to us as well as we stand paused at this major crossroad, pondering the road ahead on humanity's collective journey. The well-worn cultural paths of the Maya provide potential alternative directions for us. At a moment when many of our own cultural guides seem to have led us astray, the paths first trod by the leathery bare feet of the ancient Maya offer proven options still viable after millennia of use.

I confess that when I first began to hear about the 2012 date, I couldn't help but smile at some of the outrageous claims and outlandish speculation coming from a few of my fellow New Age spiritual seekers. However, as I've delved deeper into the subject and learned from wiser souls, I now find myself far less inclined to dismiss the 2012 phenomenon as I once did, as merely baseless assertions fed by media hype. I was genuinely amazed to learn, for example, that Maya astronomers were so brilliant that they apparently had the capability to set up their 13 pik cycle of 1,872,000 days with a zero date on a solar zenith passage over five thousand years ago and project accurately ahead to a closing date on a winter solstice in 2012, an astounding intellectual achievement for a pre-industrial culture and seeming proof that the Long Count was established with astonishing forethought. Furthermore, just as 2012 ideology tells us, Maya have described human evolution in terms of our advancement through sequential world ages.

According to Maya mythology, each age's stage of humanity was mercilessly terminated by divinely inspired catastrophes before a more evolved and properly respectful being could be created. Since ancient Maya hieroglyphic texts consistently associate the beginning of the 13 pik cycle in the Long Count with cosmic creation, couldn't the end of this massive cycle of time also imply the end of an age and its destruction? In Maya myth, the creator beings' previous experiments in making proper human beings failed due to people's lack of capacity for reverence. We six billion humans are now witnessing a form of cataclysmic environmental destruction on Earth brought about by our collective lack of respect for nature's ways. The similarity between this tragic situation and the mythological destruction of prior human generations in Maya lore is compelling.

So when people ask, "what will happen in 2012?," I have no clear answer. I feel certain that ancient Maya were aware of dimensions of the human experience that we moderns can no longer even imagine due to our culturally specific blinders. How much can we really know with certainty about the cosmos from within these narrow limits of our subconsciously developed mental parameters? Might there actually be spiritual entities who are taking this opportunity to facilitate a collective enhancement of human awareness? Who among us can even begin to understand the unseen macro-cycles that integrate the fathomless universe? Our current best "scientific" guess is that we are hurling at incalculable speeds through incomprehensively vast space with but a glimmer of knowledge as to who we are or where we are going. In this limitless all-directional cosmic context, we humans are ill-prepared for saying much definitive about very much at all, much less about such extraordinarily esoteric concepts as world ages and the evolution of consciousness.

Instead of solid answers, more questions arise. Might the recent "return" of the Long Count calendar into human awareness, after an absence of many centuries, be an archetypal alarm clock ringing in from the collective unconscious? Might personal mythologies about the Maya and 2012 developed by New Age mystics take on a life of their own and coalesce into real change on a societal scale through processes of self-fulfilling prophecy? Is 2012 merely an ingenious New Age marketing scheme or is it a subtle tipping point in humanity's collective consciousness towards heightened spiritual illumination?  I really don't know.

I sincerely doubt there will be any peak moment of terrestrial catastrophe in connection with the passing of 13 pik. My best guess is that our Earthen orb will make its daily spin on its axis just as on any other Friday on early 21st-century planet Earth, with all its normal horrific and awe-inspiring share of natural disasters, warfare, environmental degradation, personal and societal breakthroughs and breakdowns. For those not looking for any deeper meaning, the day will likely come and go as a less substantively informed version of the Y2K non-event with its survivalist excitement over potential millennial computer glitches. Yet even as I remind myself of our vast cosmic framework and urge you not to worry in the least about disaster scenarios linked to 2012, I still feel compelled to scream out a warning about the all-too-real global catastrophes of ecological and societal disintegration that are occurring as you read this very sentence.

As 2012 approaches we find ourselves increasingly disconnected from nature's patterns, ever-more insensitive to our collective assault on complex and fragile ecosystems about which we humans have but a glimmer of understanding. Species are disappearing at rates unknown since the mass extinction event that killed off the dinosaurs over sixty million years ago. One hundred million tons of plastic trash currently spin in the North Pacific Gyre and through photo-degradation will eventually pass into the tissue of marine wildlife in molecular-sized particles. There is now no place on our planet untouched by the chemical bi-products of our disintegrated lifestyles. Such contaminants now produce some 40% of human deaths worldwide.

We seem equally oblivious to the generalized abuse of our own bodies, "super-sizing" ourselves into unprecedented extremes of physical and psychological degeneration. In the United States we have, on average, over one hundred foreign chemicals storied in our bodies  and increasingly we add to the mix by forcing our children on to psychiatric drugs to help them cope with the incoherency and superficiality of the world we've created for them. Human-made hormone-mimicking contaminants now produce sexual mutations in a growing number of species, from bass to alligators; and we are finding that they adversely affect the human fetus as well. These are only a few salient examples of a planetary crisis in which we're only capable of perceiving the most apparent destruction.

Regardless of what one thinks about 2012 and the Maya calendar, if we do not change humanity's direction, the unprecedented human-induced environmental changes on our planet will become even more catastrophic. There is no question that humanity has reached a crossroads. The natural world bestowed upon us by infinitely complex processes of creation, in many very real ways, is actually ending. The coincidence between this ubiquitous environmental ruin and the world age philosophy embedded in both Maya myth and 2012 ideology is irresistibly suggestive. According to Maya, each world age comes to fruition with apocalyptic disaster in order to create more evolved forms. The earliest attempts at creation yielded the animals of the planet. The next human was made from mud but quickly dissolved. Then came people made from wood who were eventually destroyed by floods and who even had their own tools turn against them (Sound familiar?). The current age's human beings were fashioned by the Maya creator beings from corn  ground by the mythical divine Mother herself. It may indeed be time for the creators to fashion even more refined beings than we people of corn, ones more capable of living in better harmony with the complex patterns of the natural planet and ones more appreciative of role in this vast cosmos.

As we witness nature's fabric being torn, societal bonds undone, and individual human threads come loose; my mind recalls Maya weavers I've known as they patiently kneel on their earthen patios, nimbly tie together broken threads on their back strap looms and then reintegrate the astutely repaired strands back into the larger fabric. The Maya cultural paradigm tends toward keeping things whole; be it a community, the natural world, or the cloth of a woman's intricately brocaded blouse. Traditional Maya have a remarkably sturdy cultural fabric that has endured societal collapse and hundreds of years of often violent oppression in their own land under the descendants of the European invaders. It is woven with practical sensibilities learned from thousands of years of deliberately intensive interactions with the tropical ecosystems of their Middle American homelands. As with many indigenous peoples around the world, Maya intimacy with the realm of plants, animals and other life that sustains them, can lead to a profound awareness of their integrity with what they sometimes refer to as their "Mother," nature herself. They truly "get" that we humans are, at least from one very real perspective, simply another animal. We all suckle in Mother Earth's mountainous arms, wrapped in the "fabric" of her forests, nourishing ourselves with her life-giving waters.

The genuine sense of familiarity that some traditional Maya have with the earth occurs simultaneously with a broadly shared capacity for compassion fostered through deliberate nurturing of their infants, ingenious childrearing practices based on modeling of parental behavior, and the intentional cultivation of community awareness. As a consequence of these time-proven patterns of behavior, many Maya, at least those not already caught up in our globalized commercial "culture," still experience potent psychological bonds with one another almost impossible for those of us caught up in the distractions of our commercially oriented lives to imagine. In many cases they also share an experiential awareness of their oneness with the natural world around them. The hard-earned lessons that produce these more integrated states of consciousness are Maya culture's sacred offering to humanity even though, given the Maya love of humility, I doubt many of them would ever make such a claim.

As 13 Pik and the much-heralded year 2012 approach, Maya pathways potentially provide at least potential directions for beginning to mitigate and heal the severe and sometimes irreparable damage we have done to our home planet and the equally harsh physical and psychological wounds we have inflicted upon our children and ourselves. Their traditions do not beacon us skyward to learn from enlightened messengers in the heavens. Instead the call us to place our feet firmly upon the life-giving earth, to light-heartedly pick up our individual life's cargo of burdens and blessings, and then set out in earnest on the ancient trails first laid out by the ancestral Mam  millennia ago and still traveled by millions of Maya in the 21st century.

 

13 Pik: December 21, 2012

No one really knows, of course, if any extraordinary events will occur in the portentous year 2012, but human curiosity combined with easy access to electronic communication has led to a lively and multidimensional worldwide social movement surrounding the date, the so-called 2012 phenomenon.  Just as in the period leading up to Y2K, there is already an astonishing volume of attention to the 2012 date on the Internet in dozens of languages. A recent Google search combining the terms "Maya" and "2012" yielded more than two million references. Simultaneously, a rapidly growing number of books, videos, workshops and Internet communities speculate wildly as to the underlying meaning of the 2012 and what transformative events might take place.

Since José Argüelles first brought my attention to the 2012 date in 1978 with publication of The Mayan Factor: Path Beyond Technology, the 2012 phenomenon has expanded exponentially, in spite of the fact that few of us have had the chance to investigate its content with critical awareness.
The ancient Maya probably called this special day "13 pik"  (pronounced "peek"). The term refers to the current cycle of 144,000 days in the Maya Long Count, one of three principle calendars used by the ancient Maya during the so-called Classic Period of their culture (roughly 250-900 CE). This calendar, which fell into disuse among the Maya many centuries ago, is similar to our own Gregorian calendar in that it counts forward from a fixed "zero" date. For the ancient Maya, this "start" date was August 11, 3114 B.C.E.  and they associated it consistently with myths concerning cosmic creation.

Counting forward from that "zero" date in the Long Count, days, known individually as k'in, were grouped into units of twenty called winik by the ancients. Eighteen of these twenty-day winik units formed a larger unit of 360 days equal to an approximate year known to the ancient Maya as a haab and to modern researchers as a tun. Twenty of these approximate years formed a still larger unit of 7200 days called a k'atun (the ancient name may have been winikhaab).

We know from the hieroglyphs that k'atun endings were commonly celebrated by the ancient Maya and the numerous Chilam Balam texts from the Yucatan show that the importance of the k'atun continued, in what Maya called the may count, through the entirety of Spanish colonial rule. The ancient Maya combined twenty k'atun periods to form the pik, a cycle of 144,000 days or approximately 394 years. Maya counting of pik cycles gradually faded, along with use of the Long Count and hieroglyphic writing, after the Classic Period but scattered clandestine usage of these ancient cultural features probably extended into, and even through, the colonial period. The word baktun was invented early in the 20th century by archeologists who had still not deciphered the ancient writing system and so were unaware of the original word. It is also the term now adopted by many contemporary Maya from the Guatemalan highlands for referring to the 2012 date. We currently are in the final years of the 13th baktun, or as the ancients said, oxlahun pik.

Given the profound significance of the number 13 in Maya culture and the date's explicit appearance in the hieroglyphs on Monument 6 from Tortuguero, Mexico, it appears that the ancient Maya viewed a sequence of 13 piks as forming a still larger cycle of 1,872,000 days (more than 5,125 years) that some investigators refer to as the "Great Cycle." While there is legitimate scholarly debate concerning the exact day that will mark this cycle's end, I find myself siding wholeheartedly with the few Maya I know who are familiar with the 2012 date and who all prefer December 21st  because it comes on the day 4 Ahaw in their 260-day Maya ritual calendar. We have known since the 19th century that the Great Cycle began on a day associated by the ancient Maya with cosmic creation on 4 Ahaw. Since this 1,872,000 day cycle is divisible by 260, the passage of 13 piks must bring us once again to another 4 Ahaw day. The December 21st date finds confirmation in the aforementioned

Tortuguero text, the one and only reference to the 2012 date in the entirety of ancient Maya history. This seventh-century stone monument states unambiguously that the "thirteenth pik will be finished (on) 4 Ahaw, the third of K'ank'in. " The December 21st/4 Ahaw date also turns out to be the winter solstice in the northern hemisphere. I first saw this as an interesting coincidence, since solstices seems to have minimal importance in the ancient glyphs. But I then recalled that 13 pik cycle's "zero" date over 5,000 years ago occurred on a solar zenith passage at the latitude where the calendar was probably invented and I find myself unable to set aside such a remarkable mathematical and astronomical accomplishment as mere chance. Scholars have long suggested that the tzolkin calendar was developed based on the time between solar zeniths in the Mesoamerican tropics, in particular the 260 gap between the August and May zeniths at 15˚ north latitude in the area where the Maya calendars were likely invented. In establishing their Long Count calendar "zero" date on the August 11, 3114 BCE solar zenith passage, the ancients also imbedded their tzolkin ritual cycle which comes full circle 260 days later on the spring solar zenith passage.

It is important to point out that this so-called Great Cycle was only a minor component within far larger periods of time that theoretically extended infinitely backwards and forward in time using a system of exponentially increasing temporal cycles without beginning or end. Contrary to what some say about the date, no Maya calendar "ends" on 13 pik. The day merely marks the close of a large time cycle. This and the various other Maya measurements of time are perpetual in nature, just like our own Gregorian calendar.

When examining the rapidly growing and evolving cultural phenomenon surrounding the 13 pik date, one cannot help admire the consistency of altruistic attitudes among participants. Even those making the most outrageous and baseless claims seem committed to a more sustainable and healthy relationship to our natural environment and to more enlightened ways of being human. While fully appreciating that commitment, it must also be pointed out that little content in the 2012 phenomenon has much substantive basis in the Maya world. Apart from the recent publication by Maya novelist Gaspar González on 2012, nearly all writings on the subject of 2012 have been written by non-Maya who have little experiential familiarity with the Maya world .
Since most of what we hear and read concerning the Maya in the 2012 phenomenon and about the 13 pik date comes to us from sources outside the Maya world; if we hope to gain a better-informed appreciation of the year's potential significance, we must first look to the Maya themselves for answers. Ancient hieroglyphic texts and codices, the Popol Vuh, the Books of the Chilam Balam and the works of contemporary Maya are our best resources. The living voices of today's Maya connect us directly to the human "frequency" of the Maya world and their words can inspire new appreciation for their rich heritage. I, of course, cannot speak for the Maya; my sense is that many of them understand me far better than I do their world. I can merely describe my personal perspectives on this remarkable cultural current and share how Maya people have shaped my life.

 

My Own Road 

My own initial experiences with Maya culture came as I entered adulthood. The previous several years had been tumultuous; but they came after what, in retrospect, was a remarkably fortunate upbringing. Nearly my entire childhood took place in Kent, a small town with a large university in northeast Ohio. Living near the end of a dead end street, my friends and I had ready access to our favorite pond, climbing trees with handholds I still remember clearly, a massive boulder left for us during the last ice age by receding glaciers, and a particularly abundant blackberry patch. My father was a geology professor and dean at Kent State University. He planned his research well; taking me along with my mother and two sisters for extended periods of travel abroad to study stream sedimentation, one time camping for two months in gorgeous remote valleys in the eastern Pyrenees of Cataluña.

On another such trip at age 13, while in Czechoslovakia for my father to present a paper at an international geological conference, we witnessed the 1968 Soviet Invasion put an end to the buds of Prague Spring. I vividly remember all the international visitors who were staying in our hillside campground huddled in the basement of the small restaurant watching tracer bullets streak across the night sky overhead from down below in the city as we listened in silence to the thunderous rumble of the tanks pouring into town to quell any potential resistance from Czech nationalists. At first, the deafening roar of the MIGs ripping through the sky only hundreds of feet above our heads along with all the other amazing new sights was enthralling for a male teenager. Only when I heard the desperate screams of an old woman whose son had just been shot for taking photographs did my fascination instantly disappear and turn to horror. Less than two years later, the infamous May 4th shootings took place just several hundred yards from my high school in Kent. Armed National Guard troops patrolled our little street and words like "they should have killed more" in the mouths of local townspeople stung in my ears. Seeing brute violence from both the political left in Prague and from the right in Kent left me politically radicalized in the sense of searching for root causes and solutions rather than adhering to any fixed ideology.

Both my elementary and secondary education took place in the highly enriched environment of the Kent State University School, a tuition-free laboratory school for the training of teachers and educational experimentation and most of my fellow friends and students were faculty children. As part of this truly extraordinary instruction, we were discussing the writings of Malcolm X and international affairs with enthusiastic and politically savvy university graduate students. We listened to the genius of Miles Davis in the school library and joined our teachers in anti-Vietnam war protests along the small street in front of the school. I flourished in this super-stimulating environment and was always a straight-A student. Meanwhile, I was repeatedly stunned when childhood heroes were killed by assassins. Nearly every weekday evening, I was riveted to the screen by the nightly news scenes of battle from Southeast Asia and in America's burning cities. As I moved on to university studies at Kent State University, our family began to disintegrate. My father and I became deeply estranged, taking radically opposite sides in a rapidly widening generation gap. Within a two year period starting when I was in 11th grade, my father's affair was discovered; my parents went through an anguishing divorce, my father was remarried, he was diagnosed with pancreatic cancer and then died an excruciatingly painful death. Some of my clearest memories of these sad times are of driving him to his pointless and nauseating chemotherapy treatments as he sat next to me in sullen despair.

Fortunately, my exposure to psychoactive substances came in the midst of this family and societal turmoil, providing direly needed insights and a broader, far healthier perspective. I was exposed to marijuana far later than most kids in Kent, a town where some 20,000 university students formed a majority population and shaped local culture. Marijuana, in my case, just as the anti-pot literature warned, proved to indeed be a gateway drug. Thankfully, it led me to eventually experiment with LSD, psilocybin and mescaline, and I am eternally grateful for the experiences they provided, the innumerable delusion devastating and humbling insights, the liberation of remorse, and the countless unexpected blessings that have ensued as a result. By the time I arrived in southeast Mexico in February of 1977, I had already experience perhaps 20 substantive, "down on the ground" trips with LSD, mushrooms and peyote; but I had not even inkling of the far more radically transformative breakthroughs that were still waiting for their precise karmic moment to inform my being.

For those readers directly familiar with these substances, no further explanations are needed. For others, I must make clear that LSD, psilocybin, mescaline and similar psychoactive agents are not "drugs" in the sense that they numb a person to pain or provide a psychological escape. Very much to the contrary, they quickly dissolve the psychological buffers we have internalized that keep us shielded from unprocessed trauma and internalized fears. The so-called "bad trip" associated with ingestion of these substances is nothing more than a person suddenly becoming far more aware of the emotional and mental baggage they have left unattended. In general, we moderns prefer to avoid having to face such issues. Has no one noticed that there is no peyote addition problem, no LSD or mushroom rehabilitation programs? Not only are these substances completely non-addictive, the experiences they facilitate are not typically comfortable, pleasant, or relaxing. Very much to the contrary, they often feel traumatic, gut-wrenching (sometimes literally), world view-shattering, and overpowering; not what most people desire in our cultural paradigm focused on pleasure, ease and comfort.

Numerous Mesoamerican peoples have used these psyche-illuminating substances as part of their cultural practices. There are several Native groups in Mexico for example that still ingest peyote or various psilocybin-bearing mushrooms. Ironically, for Americans used to associating mind-altering substances with social degeneration, the Huichol, Cora, Mazatec and other peoples who use these substances are also some of the most cohesive, environmentally sustainable and self-sufficient societies in our continent. The archeological record suggests that the ancient Maya also employed psychoactive mushrooms since they left behind hundreds of stone mushroom figures. Not surprising, for those familiar with the consciousness-enhancing effects of psilocybin, these mushroom stones were found at the very same early Maya sites where the culture's greatest advances took place.

Further reinforcing the positive role of so-called hallucinogens in Maya culture, images of the DMT-producing cane toad (bufo marinus) were found at the early site of Izapa, in place closely linked to development of their intricate calendar traditions.

While the use of such substances certainly cannot guarantee any substantive positive change, much less an inner awakening, in my own case, they were an indispensable catalyst for recreating my life. The Ohio woods and fields of my childhood had been bulldozed. Watching my father die had provided a virtual preview of my own mortality, pushing me to explore life in earnest. I had witnessed political madness from both the left and the right, pushing me to search deeper for direction.  I had read the first books of Carlos Castaneda and was intrigued by the tales of his exploits with Don Juan. I had been blessed with a truly beautiful and loving girlfriend and the lessons from psychoactive allies had shown both of us that life had far more to offer than our culture had led us to believe. Without knowing it, life's circumstances had swept the road clear in front of us and now it was time to start our journey. We loaded up our packs for three months of adventure in the backcountry of Mexico without even a clue that our lives were about to be permanently and radically transformed.

 

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The Owl exists in a state of ecstasy...watching starbursts of light creating visible things..

She can turn her head backwards to watch light and 'galactic beams' coming into 3D.

Whenever humans have gotten out of balance, the Owl returns...It is a harbinger..a bird of great warning..She is the Keeper of the Species..the great bird of the forests.

She sits on the Temple of the Nine Underworlds of Dzibilchaltun.

She watches as the Serpent of Light descends down the pyramid of Kukulcan........at sunset a gigantic meteor- The Plumed Serpent, Quetzalcoatl, crashes over Chichen Itza.....and sinks into the sea.

Interesting story about the

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Yes John Major Jenkins is on

Yes John Major Jenkins is on http://coasttocoastam.com right now about his new 2012 book that debunks the recent "apocalypse" 2012 mass media campaign (on cable, in Hollywood, etc.). Izapa - he mentions this as the transition, post-Olmec, Pre-Maya culture that started this calendar system.

 Nevertheless Peter Tompkin's son Ptolemy has written an excellent Mayan book about the shamanic tradition which doesn't necessarily rely on the calendars. Similarly "Secrets of the Talking Jaguar" by Martin Prechtel is about the VILLAGE Mayans who, again don't rely on this Solar-based calendar system. We have to ask WHY were the Mayans -- the ritual Solar priests -- AFRAID of zero?

Even if 2012 is not some apocalypse certainly the idea of renewal through total destruction does lie hidden in the calendar system, such is the power of zero as the original Kali of India or Chronos of Greece. Callehan's Mayan Calendar work exposes Arguelles' errors of the 28 day Lunar calendar against the real Mayan 29.5 Lunar averaged calendar. But regardless the Lunar against the Solar and Earth do not line up and eventually ZERO sneaks up again, destroying the whole "divide and average" Solar ritual mass sacrifice calendar system.

Go for it -- obsess about 2012 but then that's no different than the other Solar mass ritual sacrifice priests, including the current Freemason scientists. haha The real Mayan culture is the matrifocal village tradition, not relying on the Solar Pyramid ritual sacrifice priests afraid of zero.

Valuable message, questionable dates

This seventh-century stone monument states unambiguously that the “thirteenth pik will be finished (on) 4 Ahaw, the third of K'ank'in.” The December 21st/4 Ahaw date also turns out to be the winter solstice in the northern hemisphere.

I read R. Sitler's essay in the book 'Mysteries of 2012', in which he presumes to negate Mayanist C.J. Calleman's theory solely by the existence of the monument 6 inscription. According to Calleman the 4 Ahau date was assigned well after the inception of the calendar, in the same way that Jesus's birth was assigned to Dec. 25 much later on. Apparently the solar zenith has little to do with the evolution of consciousness. From Calleman.com:

The fact that the Mayan Long Count was based on the day the sun was in zenith in Izapa, has however created a very significant misunderstanding among modern people, and this is that it would end on December 21, 2012. The particular date the sun is in zenith in this location obviously has no relevance in the rest of the world, but because of the power of tradition some will still adhere to it. In reality, the creation cycle that began as the First Father erected the World Tree will end on October 28, 2011. This day is also 13 Ahau in the sacred Mayan calendar, an energy with great prophetical relevance.

Using Calleman's model, the calendar ends on 13.13.13.13.13.13.13.13.13 13 Ahau. 'Coincidentally', 09/09/09 was the first day of the third-to-last Tzolkin round of 260 days. The last round starts on Feb 02, 2011, and is also the first day of the 9th and final Underworld of universal time and consciousness. The 'end' of the calendar is one Tzolkin round later, coinciding with the completion of all 9 levels of evolution (started 16 billion years ago), on Oct 28, 2011. It's not the end of the world, it's the end of cycles.

Calleman's model makes perfect sense of the 9 underworlds (represented in the 9 steps of Mayan pyramids, see picture in this article) and the 7 Lords of Creation, and explains the references to Bolon Yookte on monument 6 as the manifestation of the wholeness of the 9 Underworld gods, achieved on 13.13.13.13.13.13.13.13.13 13 Ahau.

Finally, Calleman has correctly predicted numerous world events using the calendar and its model of shifting energies in time. He predicted the beginning of the current economic crisis to the month, and says this november we'll see a much harsher impact, as we are now entering the 6th Night of the Thirteen Heavens on November 7th (a few days before the '2012' movie release on 11/11).

I urge readers to check out http://www.calleman.com and resonate with the Calleman's interpretation of the Mayan calendar. With this knowledge we can help to minimize the impact of the fear-based 'singular' doomsday meme of 2012 and enter this window of time with open hearts, which is essential regardless of whether we're talking about 2011 or 2012.

I smell that unsubtle stink

I smell that unsubtle stink of racism dressed up in "greater consciousness and peace" playclothes. Just like there was racism in those California kids playing Indian dress-up to raise money for BM.

 

Documentarians, new agers, etc. are making shit up about 2012, and they're able to rest their statements on the supposed authority of the Mayans. The troubling part is that these white sensationalists can completely fabricate things about an entire culture and get away with it, because the actual Mayans are so marginalized that many people don't even realize they exist.

 

Even if making shit up about 2012 isn't racist in itself, it illustrates a systemic problem with the way we relate to native people. Namely that we understand them almost exclusively through the reports of non-natives, and these reports are often sensationalized BS.

 

How many actual native voices are there on this site, as contributors? Do 2012ers ever asked the Mayans what they want for their communities? Like health care or education? Or is it all about me and my white enlightenment and healing and super-magic powerzzzz?

true that

i'm glad you pointed this out as it is something we do have a major problem with 2012 and indigenous cultures in general. In allowance of the fact that many of these reports come from well-to-do scholars and researchers, it is important to keep in mind exactly what their directive is. Clinging to the authority of having met a true Mayan and expressing their "sensationalized" story does not solidify anything except that writers basically write themselves into a career... However, in terms of an open dialogue without biting cynicism, there are many truths to be hashed out of these stories/essays/articles. Let us not blindly appropriate these messages as they are told but use them as stepping stones on our path, just as this author has intended. =)

good insights, surlytemple

Namaste all. - Melanie D.

On racism, the contemporary Maya and Calleman

Thanks to all for your comments on my chapter. I am very sensitive to Surlytemple's concern about racism. My doctoral dissertation was focused specifically on racist interpretations of the Maya world in regional literature written by Hispanic authors. Surlytemple (I love the name), I hope you can locate two published articles of mine concerning how a similar thing has happened with 2012. In fact, I believe I was the first researcher to focus on debunking New Age speculation concerning the date. The first article is entitled, "The 2012 Phenomenon: New Age Appropriation of an Ancient Mayan Calendar" and was published in Nova Religio, an academic journal way back in 2006. The second is a chapter in "The Mystery of 2012: Predictions, Prophecies & Possibilities." Both articles are highly critical of the New Age 2012 hype and both point to solid sources in the Maya world for more reliable information on the topic.

 

I have had the good fortune of visiting with Maya for over 30 years among speakers of a dozen Maya languages and have Maya visitors staying regularly in our home. While I would not say I can speak a Maya language, I can get by in Mam, one of the main languages of the Guatemalan highlands. I have traveled to the Maya region on four occasions specifically to interview Maya about 2012. I have a website of exclusively Maya perspectives on 2012 at: www.stetson.edu/~rsitler/13PIK/ Surlytemple, I think you might enjoy it.

 

Also, I recently completed translation of Maya writer Gaspar Gonzalez's book on 2012 that will be coming out soon from North Atlantic Books. It will be the first book on 2012 to have been written by a Maya and is entitled "13 Baktun." My own book, coming out in Oct. 2010, apart from debunking most of the hoopla about 2012, focuses almost entirely on the Maya themselves and the many lessons they have to teach us about birthing, childcare, ties to nature, respect for elders, experientially based spirituality and much more ... all derived from my direct experience in the Maya world.

 

Finally, for John from the Temple, on Calleman ... I truly admire Dr. Calleman for his creativity and free-thinking spirit. Such beings enrich our world. However, his work has virtually no basis at all in Maya culture, past or present. Without exception, all creation dates in the Maya glyphs specify 4 Ahaw as the Tzolkin date, not just the Tortuguero text specifying the cycle completion in 2012. For reasons I can't explain, Calleman seems intent on accusing anyone who doesn't accept his October, 2011 date as being a proponent of doom and gloom. This is hardly the case. In truth, ALL serious Maya researchers (real ones, not New Agers) apart from Calleman accept a December, 2012 date for the close of the 13th pik cycle and not one of them thinks anything cataclysmic will happen.

13 Ahau, the Completion of Time

Thanks for your reply, mr. Sitler. I respect the depth of your experience and research on the Maya. Though I've been interested in '2012' for years, there remain a lot of unanswered questions.

Unfortunately you said nothing in your response to counter Calleman's theory, other than an appeal to majority. I would be very grateful if you could provide or point to some specific arguments (not just counter-theories) against the following from Calleman:

1. The starting date is subjective to begin with.

The exact Long Count beginning date ultimately is calibrated based on the date of solar zenith in Izapa, which occurs on August 12. This solar zenith day was since long, long before the Long Count was implemented, considered as the day of the year when “time began” and considered as a holy date in the location of Izapa. There is thus every reason to believe that the solar zenith was the reason the initial day in the Long Count, 4 Ahau 8 Cumku, was set on this day, although obviously the date of solar zenith in Izapa has nothing to do with the real beginning of the corresponding divine creation cycle.

2. The calendar is not based on astronomy.

The creation cycles described by the Maya, including the tzolkin, are fundamentally of a spiritual, non-astronomical, nature. Thus, any theory that implies that the Mayan Long Count would have been designed to reflect astronomical phenomena, be it the precession of the earth or a solar zenith, is a warning signal that its originator is off the mark. It should be obvious that if the Mayan calendar is a prophetic calendar describing cosmic energy cycles of a universal nature then the particular date at which the sun was in zenith in the particular location of Izapa is totally irrelevant for us who live today and must be considered as nothing but a result of a tradition too strong to be changed.

3. Cycles do not end simultaneously on 21/12/2012.

Another equally compelling reason why December 21, 2012 cannot be the true date of completion of creation is that this day is 4 Ahau in the tzolkin count. Since the Long Count consists of exactly 7200 tzolkin rounds then the true end of creation must fall on a day that is 13 Ahau in the tzolkin count so that the tzolkin rounds even out.

Quotes are from "Why the Creation Cycles End on Oct. 28, 2011" by C.J. Calleman, from http://www.calleman.com/content/articles/end_of_creationcycles.htm The section 'Debate Articles' under Article Summary on Calleman's website is very provocative.

 

From your link:

At the time of the 13 Baktun and 13 Ahau is the time of the return of our Ancestors and the return of the men of wisdom.

[Don Alejandro]

Which Gregorian date is he referring to here (loaded question)?

 

Thanks for any response you can afford.

Thanks, John

Dear John,

I truly appreciate the friendly tenor of your response. Basic kindness is something that, ironically given the supposed movement towards higher consciousness in the 2012 phenomenon, often gets lost in on-line discussions.

I'll do my best to respond in order of your points:

1. In your quote, Calleman himself points to 4 Ahaw as the beginning of the Long Count and as well as a zenith passage date. As such, the close of 13 pik cycles would also of course be on 4 Ahaw. I'm confused here, John. You seem to be simply reaffirming exactly what I said in my chapter. I'm not qualified to say what the Maya meant when they set up the calendar but I somehow doubt that Dr. Calleman is either.

2. I'm unclear as to how you can assert with such certainty that the Long Count has no relation to astronomy immediately after stating that the calendar was set up on a solar zenith passage. The fact that the 13th pik cycle concludes on a winter solstice adds even further confirmation to the calendar's astronomical underpinnings. Besides, why would astronomical and spiritual perspectives be mutually exclusive? To me, that they would coincide gives the date further potential significance. Again, the words quoted appear contradictory and seem to rely primarily on the argument that it's "obvious."

3. The quote assumes 13 Ahaw is the beginning or end of a tzolkin cycle without basis. What would make one think that 13 Ahaw is the beginning or end of the cholq'ij? The K'iche', the main Maya ethnicity still using the cholq'ij, always celebrate the beginning of the the 260 calendar on 8 B'atz. I think that the Mam used to celebrate theirs a day earlier on 7 Tz'i. Not a single Maya hieroglyphic text refers to the 13 Ahaw date being proposed by Dr. Calleman. John, what's your personal take on that? If 13 Ahaw was so important, why never mention it even once? Stuck on tradition? Maybe, ... but it seems like a stretch.

 

I love your last question, John. I've tried to get an answer directly from tat Cirilo (as he's called in Guatemala) but no response. As you may know, very few Maya recognize him as their spokesperson. Actually, I don't know any at all that do. If you doubt that, please start inquiring with all the Maya you know. If one accepted everything said by Cirilo, then we would have to accept that Maya came from Atlantis and the Pleiades. I don't know a single other Maya who believes in such things apart from Hunbatz Men.

 

Hopefully, the last laugh will be on me. I enjoy finding out when I'm wrong so please feel free to crack open my little head a bit more.

 

Again Juanito del Templo, thanks so much for your warm response.

roberto

For the sake of argument

Wow, thanks for your thoughtful reply Robert! Perhaps I should have been a little clearer in my post, as it seems you didn't quite catch where Calleman's perspective diverges from others? I'll try to summarize my understanding of his argument in this regard, and sincerely hope I'm not misrepresenting him.

The start of the Long Count was assigned to 4 Ahau. It is apparently unclear how the Maya arrived at this date. According to Calleman, yourself, and others it resulted from the passing of the solar zenith in Izapa, where the Mayan long count was devised--a day celebrated as the annual/death rebirth of time. Another possibility is that they counted backwards from the prophesied end date, which seems to be the point of J.M. Jenkins. Calleman, however, argues that both derivations are faulty by being Earth-centric, whereas the sacred calendar is ultimately a model of cosmic time in which physical forces of evolution are secondary to spiritual forces.

The question then becomes, what could be the correct start of the Long Count? Calleman calculates it on the following premise: the end of creation will complete all cycles simultaneously, because the sacred energy of 13 demands it. This is based on the fact that 13 Ahau is the energy of the completion of time, as opposed to 4 Ahau which is a birth or creation energy.

The fact that most Guatemalan Maya start their Tzolkin on 8 Chuen (B'atz) neither confirms nor supports either perspective, but shows that we should be careful as to what we consider to be authentic. To wit, many modern Maya see their various gods as actual spiritual entities rather than the archetypal energies of time they represent, so we cannot pretend that the Mayans are exempt from history's corrupting effect on knowledge. So finally, keeping in mind that both the Long Count and the 260 day calendar pre-date even the Maya themselves, it seems feasible that the Izapans were just as susceptible to error as the rest of us humans.

To be sure, neither I nor Calleman claim that there is no astronomical relation to the calendar. That would be silly and self-defeating. The Mesoamerican understanding of time is transcendent, in that it integrates the physical and the spiritual manifestations of the Creator. Clearly there are astronomical correlates, which is also why Calleman stresses the importance of the Venus transit as understood by the Maya. More fundamentally, the entire calendar is based on counting the Earth's rotations, or days. Nevertheless, considering that the Maya projected dates backwards and forewards by millions, billions, and even nonillions of years, before the Big Bang (Coba stone), it should be clear that the calendar may in fact not be based on astronomical cycles but on something more primary.

To entertain Calleman's interpretation of the Long Count requires the ability to partially let go of what authorities tell us, including both scholars and the Maya themselves, and to look at the calendar from outside of the context from which it seems to have emerged. His model may not be airtight at this point, but his vision of 9 levels of evolution and 13 energies of time allows the most holistic interpretation of time and consciousness I have seen from any Mayan calendar theory, and the predictions it entails are very convincing in light of what know about Earth history. Finally, it resonates perfectly with the concept of the World Tree which is central to Mayan mythology.

I was disappointed that you avoided my last question concerning don Alejandro. I thought you might mention the 13 Ahau that falls on 03/31/2013, which he claims will bring a period of darkness followed by a rebirth, but instead you merely suggested that he's unreliable. In that case, perhaps you should consider removing his quote from your webpage?

Respectfully playing the Devil's advocate so that we may all benefit from understanding,

Juanito del Templo

Picture of <em>John Major Jenkins</em>

Diversions

I think it would be great if the comments and threads could focus on the many interesting items that Robert Sitler's contribution brought up, instead of going down a runnel with the idiosyncratic inventions of Calleman.

There are those who try to understand the Maya by befriending, experiencing, living and working with the Maya and studying their ancient traditions. Robert Sitler is one of them. And there are those who reject established facts, do not spend much time studying the Maya traditions, and quickly and happily cobble together their own model or method or system. Carl Calleman has this approach.

I speak from having actually engaged Calleman's work in debates and email exchanges going back to 1999. He belongs to an arena of people that is very common, and growing, in the 2012 discourse. This arena includes basically everyone who marginalizes Maya teachings and traditions in their approach to 2012. Within this arena, there is a spectrum from very silly to passably reasonable, but it would be great if we could respect what bridge people, like Robert, bring to the table. To call him a racist is ridiculous, and to counter his perspectives with Calleman's factually incorrect diversions puts a genuinely gracious and patient guy on the defensive and appropriates this space for other agendas.         

And I won't re-re-respond here to whatever objections Calleman's followers might offer, as hundreds of pages of clear assessment, exchanges, and information on that topic can be found on my website.

 

John Major Jenkins
http://Alignment2012.com
http://the2012story.com
http://Update2012.com

 

Some more thoughts on Calleman's thesis

Hola Juanito,

I love having a real exchange about this because Dr. Calleman an his work truly amaze me.

I'm glad we agree on the start and end dates of the long count and their astronomical importance. Dr. Calleman is also correct that the dates are completely Earth-centric. However, I don't think this is surprising given Maya culture's location on planet Earth. How could they be otherwise? 

 

His statement that:"the sacred calendar is ultimately a model of cosmic time in which physical forces of evolution are secondary to spiritual forces" isn't very meaningful. Are evolutionary forces somehow not spiritual? He seems to make assumptions about what the ancient Maya intended without evidence apart from his own statements. I'm not comfortable claiming that the ancient Maya were incorrect about their own calendar. Honestly, it strikes me as more than a bit silly (some would say arrogant) to say we now know more about the ancient calendar than its makers did when they invented it thousands of years ago.

 

To claim as proof for a 13 Ahau cycle open/closing that "the sacred energy of 13 demands it" is virtually meaningless. If that were true, why did no Maya refer to this "demanding" date? I agree with you that "The fact that most Guatemalan Maya start their Tzolkin on 8 Chuen (B'atz) neither confirms nor supports either perspective" but it does show that Maya are not stuck on using 13. 13 is apparently not THAT "demanding."  It appears Dr. Calleman wants to say that both the ancients AND modern Maya were/are mistaken. His work claims that the ancient Maya calendar scribes were wrong, the contemporary Maya daykeepers are wrong, all professional Maya scholars are wrong and only Dr. Calleman is correct. That's possible, of course, but ... it's hard for me to find it very convincing. 

 

Dr. Calleman's work seems to presume that only he knows the intentions of the "real" ancients were (as opposed to the mistaken and "stuck on tradition" Classic Period calendar priests) and that anyone who says different is not sufficiently spiritual to understand the calendar's "true" meaning or locked into some sort of cataclysmic 2012 scenario. It really seems quite authoritarian to be honest.

I can easily let go of authoritarian interpretations.  I have found out VERY frequently in my life that I am wrong and sometimes that authorities are wrong as well. Are you willing to concede the same concerning Dr. Calleman's work? Is it possible that he might he be wrong? As you suggest, some of his core ideas are far from airtight. They seem to be based primarily on simply his saying that's the way it is. I have a very difficult time finding any real evidence for most of his claims.

John, I was not trying to avoid your last question. Actually I would LOVE to find out the answer. Pleae help me if you can. I'd really like to know what tat Cirilo says. I simply don't know the answer. I explained that I attempted to find out what he meant but there has been no response yet. I actually do think it is quite possible that don Cirilo's information is unreliable. I am extremely fallible myself and I think he might be too. Isn't that our human nature?

The point of my "Maya Perspectives on 2012" page (www.stetson.edu/~rsitler/13PIK/) is not that the quotes say what is going to happen in 2012  (they are contridictory). Instead I had hoped to move away from what just a bunch of white guys like myself say and point to what a few real Maya think might happen. I don't vouch for the reliability of any of it.

 

John, my sincere thanks again for your patience with me. You are helping me to clarify my own thinking.

All the best from Florida,

roberto

 

Count your lucky stars

Thanks for the positive feedback Roberto, I'm honored and greatful to take part in this exchange. Like you said, it's helping me to clarify my own thinking. Hopefully the same counts for some of the other readers as well. Mr. Jenkins' response got me worried that I may have 'hijacked' the topic, but I think there's no harm done. After all, all three authors (Sitler, Jenkins & Calleman) have been featured on Reality Sandwich. That said, I'm just a layman and in no way looking to recreate the end-date debate in this thread.

It's important to acknowledge that Calleman's model is not truly the Mayan calendar. As I see it, Calleman takes the Mesoamerican system of measurement of time and cross-interprets it with Maya/Aztec mythology and our current understanding of history and science to arrive at a fractal map of evolution that is internally consistent, harmonizes with other creation myths, and shows very strong corroboration in physical reality. As a pragmatic agnostic, I'm not particularly threatened by the 420-day discrepancy in Calleman's long count (especially since the traditional start of the Long Count appears subjectively Maya- and Earth-centric, not cosmic), and am more interested in the value of the model as a whole.

For those intrigued or turned off by Calleman's fractal model of time and consciousness based on the Mayan calendar, the following may be found of interest--a revealing explanation of the 'glitch' in the Calleman Matrix, the apparently incomplete Tzolkin round needed to match up with the final 13 Ahau. Calleman claims/admits it's the only possible hole in his theory, but it may not be one at all. I haven't checked if this post by Andrew Terry holds up, but I think even Calleman himself isn't aware of his insights yet:

http://www.breakfornews.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=24512

In the end, all calendars attempt to measure an ineffable mystery, just as all evolution attempts to achieve an untouchable perfection. At this point in time, all roads increasingly lead to Rome. Soon we'll all have to let go of our attempts at controlling time and simply give in to living Truth.

Peace and thanks,

John from the Tempel


Picture of <em>revolutionrabbit</em>

hello, from a crazy wisdom poet

i'm not all that up on the dates thang, in fact i have been nibbling this whole thing since i heard Terence Mckenna talk back in the 80's, and even though i tend to see the whole "New Age" label as a infringement of sorts on the real meaning and purpose of the Mayan calendar and also to that that extent all indigenous people that have been exploited, and also used in this "new age" stage, i too see that there is a gross tendency to try to somehow gloss over and apply layers of thought that have been appropriated for theories on spirituality and history, ect. However i think it is counterproductive to say remarks like "make shit up"about 2012, i can see the connection with ideas that might be misapprehended and might even be used in a less then honest way.Yet i do not see anybody making a federal case for this line of reasoning.I see head nodding, and then it just slips by.Nevertheless, i suspect when somebody says something like "make shit up" that that person ought to look at their own made up stuff before jumping on the either you are 2012 new age shit maker upper or you are hip to the new age miss-mash mix and match, and so then you are now hipper then them complex.And this is where the real fun begins.

also i prolly be flagged now for sayin "shit" even though i was only quoting the surlytemple.And i will get another email from the new age staff on realitysandwich.And so this whole new age old age shmage mage made it up as you go along whole situation gets hidden and covered over, like i was want to say.If you get my drift, short shrift.

Age of Newness

Just as a side point ... how often there comes a time in conversation where someone has to say "new age like" ... as if one could ever separate age from aging.

Science is new age ... cars computers ... industry ... post industry ... neo-post etc etc

All is new age phantasmagoria ... always and only ... caught up in the"present" maya/illusion ... each and every generational culture new unto themselves.

There is no cycle that is 'but another cycle.

The only difference is that in present information/data based media scale communication the art of stereotyping has become it's own perpetuating nemesis.

No one ever knows anything beyond the moment.

  Such moments can only 'but become lost in deterministic mechanistic type thinking.

Imagine carry on a conversation without interpretation, comparison, or generalization.

The very difference between "knowing" ... and "knowing about"

When it comes to indigenous wisdom ... well it takes one to know one.... no amount of licking the outside of the honey jar will give one a taste of actual honey.

In our virtual ideology ... actuality is lost. 

Picture of <em>Chris Douglas</em>

Refreshing and insightful wisdom

I very much appreciate the viewpoint that the destruction of the world as we know it needn’t have anything to do with a specific point in time in the year 2012. The destruction so many fearful people are concerned about is, in fact, happening right now, every day of our lives through our unconscious behaviors and attacks on the earth, on each other, on ourselves and on our children. By focusing on December 21, 2012, I can see how many people might rationalize not bothering to see and learn the lessons being offered us all right now or to change their behaviors towards themselves, others and the earth. Why bother? It’s all going to end in a couple years anyway!

Additionally, I appreciate the reflections Dr. Sitler has shared on the way most "civilized" people use state-altering drugs to numb their pain and dull their consciousness. This speaks volumes about "modern" westerners unconscious tendencies to seek comfort through denial of reality and how that has contributed to our current state of cultural and environmental degradation. The Maya and other indigenous people, on the other hand, have used these substances to look straight into the inconvenient truths of themselves and the world and to attune themselves to more expanded consciousness and wisdom-based ways of living.

Looking forward to reading the rest of the book!

Picture of <em>revolutionrabbit</em>

wow so much said

but in the end it just eats its own words tail.Let me see we have some kind of right way of thinking comments,vague remarks about oppression, then we jump on the new age bandwagon, or did i miss something? Know we condescend on people who take psychedelics, and yup we tell the author how great he is? Is this what the bock-toons are all about, in the end we get the same old authoritarian self-rightous holy-then thou-ness.Wow sorry i'm not a Mayan, but if i was i would take psychedelics to be more mayan.If i had a just so great life and had the time to study Mayan calendars with a fine tooth comb, and in the end i would have yuppies tell me how wonderful i am. That i am on the right side of the dates.

oh your not a yuppie? my bad, you are just a reformed hippie.Saw the error in your self-indulgent ways, and now you see the what the bleep light.Yes i am now all focused on 2012 because yet another in with the Mayan person told me so.I wonder how many people you know that say"why bother, the world is going to end in 2012 anyway"

maybe you could try rewriting this, and sound a tad more sincere, and less obvious chummy up with the author.But who am i? just one of those terrible old hippies that thinks the world is going to end on 2012, eating my psychedelic cake too.

Picture of <em>Chris Douglas</em>

Re: wow so much said

Hmmmm... It's hard to know exactly where you are coming from (revolutionrabbit) but I must say, I feel like you put on your judgment hat in a big way in making your comment. I'm honestly not sure what it was I said that offended you so but it's difficult for me to seriously consider your concerns when your words feel so cynical, angry and judgmental. If my assessment of where you are coming from is accurate, this is just the kind of attitude and energy that leads to conflict, cycles of violence and destruction in this world. What the world needs now is wisdom, courage, compassion and understanding of one another.

 I do appreciate what the author has said here. I really do. I think he's offered some valuable insights into the current state of the world and some wisdom from the Maya and other indigenous people is something we "moderns" could really benefit from right now.

I hope you find peace.

Picture of <em>revolutionrabbit</em>

funny

i was commenting on your seeming praise of the author in fact all you did was sort of say back what the author said.I wonder if that is why people like him write the things they write, just so others can tell then how great they are.And of course comment about people saying "why bother , the world is going to end anyway" Is this what all this is about? How many books are there about 2012 and Mayan calenders? And how many people think its all going to end anyway? It all seems almost like a distraction. The arguments by Jenkens and others, makes me want to take drugs.No, not really, i just don't see how all this really makes any difference.I liked when i first heard Terence Mckenna talk about all this stuff, there was some poetic insight going on, but now it just seems to be about selling books, which is fine, but i don't feel all wowed by any of this quible on dates.It's good that the author spent time with the Indians.Anyway I just see the same kinds of word for word comments that don't really add anything.And if all you are ruffled by my comments, oh i'm so cynical.That just shows what I'm saying, it now is about my cynicalness, what happened to 2012? and all this profound meaning to the dates and the changes, are we able to actually manifest this, in our comments or are we just telling yet another author that writes about this stuff how wonderful he is?I don't mean to just jump on your comments, you really didn't say much of anything, it just seems to me that you typify a kind of comment type, that is all people are suppose to do around here, tell others how wonderful they are.Ok you are wonderful! Excuse me, i just want to hear more, on another level, not the usual, how great the author is, even if he is.Nevermind, its all gonna be like Terence said, even if he was just another Heraclitian/JamesJoycian/Whiteheadian.

Peace, Love , and Diggers

CJ Moore

      Sorry to see you back again. I know from previous experiences with you that my calling you out will only encourage your belligerence and exacerbate the unnecessary tension you ultimately bring to a discussion, but I feel that now is the appropriate time, considering the reappearance of responses that your comments always create, such as the one by Chris Douglas, above.

      I'm not saying that you don't have a right to be here (That is not for me to decide), I'm just saying that I know who you are.

      Please, to everyone else here, the last thing I want to do is kidnap this thread, so please don’t respond here to this post. Contact me directly if you must.

      Thank you.

Practical Lessons from Ancient wisdom

2 Imix

Robert

 You wrote "These eminently practical lessons from the Maya have the potential to “ground” our lives more harmoniously into nature’s infinitely complex ways, to broaden our perspectives on human existence and to connect us more substantively with our innate capacity for compassion".

Such well crafted words to describe what we all are being given an opportunity to learn. My own experiences with the Mayan in Guatemala, Aboriginal Elders in the Australian outback, Quechua in Peru and the Nepalese cracked open my heart and cleared the path.

Look forward to hearing more of your experience in living these practical lessons. My hope is that we can transcend the current focus and argument on the dates of the end of this cycle and instead focus on what opportunities this incredible time right now is creating for all. This right/wrong thinking is what is currently being released. Yahoo!!! Both John Jenkins and Carl Calleman's insights and research have been very helpful and are so appreciated.

To implement these practical lessons into my own life has meant letting go of pretty much everything our current Western culture values. Neither easy nor comfortable yet the joys are beyond words.

 In Lakesh and Namaste

Thanks

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